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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2012, 12:52 pm 
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Market Man6 wrote:
market man6 wrote:
im waiting to hear more from aragorn, lander and tahu...

i was going to force something out of aragorn, simply because he is alphabetically first, and each of the three is as good a guess as the next.... but lander has more votes on him, and adding one more will get more results.

also, lander, this has nothing to do with my previous vote on you in phase I. that old vote was simply because at that time, you hadnt said anything for the longest period of time.


Unless everyone else is role claiming I'm not going to, it'd be stupid to make myself a target. The odds of killing a pro townie power role seem to me too much of a risk.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2012, 3:00 pm 
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Ok, let's clear up this whole probability of roles business. Last game, the role assortment was:
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Doctor
Med Student
Detective
Doctor
Villager
Villager
Villager

Assuming the role assortment this game is:
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Doctor
Med Student
Detective
Doctor
Villager
Villager

Then we have three possibilities:
If a player was a Mafia Goon last game, they have a 1/3 (2/6) chance of being a villager and a 2/3 (4/6) chance of being a power role.
If a player was a power role last game, they have a 3/8 chance of being mafia, 1/4 (2/8) chance of being a villager, and 3/8 chance of being a different power role.
If a player was a villager last game, they have a 3/7 chance of being mafia and a 4/7 chance of being a power role.

This results in an interesting situation: as Lander pointed out, those who were villagers last game are now most likely to be mafia, but also very likely to be power roles. The chance of them being mafia is also not much higher than that of a former power role being mafia, and the former power role has a lower chance of being a power role again. However you look at it, we've got a high chance of hitting a power role from a blind lynch on anyone. I've seen too many instances of the village blind-lynching Day 1 and hitting the doctor or detective to personally participate in a blind lynch, especially with two power roles that can gather information that we might potentially lynch.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2012, 3:22 pm 
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Tahu I don't know where you got two 'Doctors' from. There was a Doctor and an Insomniac (Watcher).

The speed at which Lander's train has picked up is a little alarming, but I would agree that he needs to roleclaim, though we run into a bit of a problem if he's the Doctor.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2012, 3:24 pm 
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If he is the Doc, then perhaps the Med Student role will become useful?

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2012, 3:29 pm 
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absolutely it will!
...if we have one. seeing as the mafia has more power.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2012, 4:26 pm 
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Hey, Tahu posted sense! Too bad Tahu thinks Lander said it first, because he didn't, since 3/7 isn't the 50% that Lander has failed to recant twice now.

Why'd you say that, Tahu?


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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2012, 6:49 pm 
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Did I really put Doctor in twice? Whoops. Replace that with Insomniac. That's a typo and my math still holds true.

I'm not agreeing with Lander's numbers or the numbers of anyone who said 50% for anything. I am, however, agreeing that people who were previously villagers have the highest chance of being mafia this time around, if only by 3/56s more than a previous power role. Also, I must stress that I am basing my statistics upon a decently large chunk of conjecture, though Jaron has yet to do anything overtly crazy as far as roles go.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 3:16 am 
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Well then. Following is my real analysis of the probability situation, which tahu has more or less already covered.

Quote:
If this is the route to take, everyone else has a 33% chance of being scum. A chance of getting vanilla townie, a power role, or mafia. This is a descriptivist type of thing and doesn't account for numbers or other variables. This makes it a weak (but simple) theory, I guess. Each roll has one of two (or three) outcomes. Power role (town aligned) or mafia. 50/50.

Of course, you could break it down further, as any of us former vanilla could be insomniac, doctor, med student, detective, or one of three(?) mafia. Still 3/7, or 42.85%. This still makes us more likely to be mafia than anyone else, however. Everyone else has the odds of two vanilla townie roles, three power roles (minus whatever they were last time) and three(?) mafia slots. 3/8, or 37.5%.

You could also look at the odds as 2:3:3 for everyone else, and 4:3 for us if you're into ratios.

The initial 3/7 probability for everyone was wrong, as you need to account for both vanilla townie spots and all three mafia spots, not just the roles. This probability is more likely what you had in mind, but it still supports my point: those who were vanilla townies last game have a higher chance of being mafia this time around.

The 50/50 thing isn't *wrong*, it just doesn't account for the variables. If you have three red squares versus a blue ball, a green ball, a purple ball, and a yellow ball, what are the odds of drawing a square versus the odds of drawing a ball? Color (the role) hardly matters, because it's the fact that it's a ball (town-aligned) that's important. Even with this, the 50/50 thing seems like bs. In retrospect, it wasn't the best way to illustrate my point. My argument is that there are two types of shapes. Which doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

In short: Probability is a bunch of nonsense and you can look at it a number of ways, but each way ends in us more likely to be scum. Hence why my vote stays on Tahu at this point.


I had this drafted up for my last response, but decided not to post it because it got too convoluted. I'll just leave it here after all, in its original form. I spent like 30-40 minutes going through it, so I sent it in a PM to myself for future use, as I was sure I'd need it. I had hoped to revise it before now, but I'm pretty eager to wash my hands of this probability bullcrap.

As Tahu said, the bottom line is that we have a higher chance of being mafia. That's all.

I'm the med student, by the way. But please proceed with the lynch.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 7:04 am 
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That solves that then since I'm the Med Student.

Landerpurex

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 7:52 am 
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Lander. Either he's lying and is scum, or Top is lying and is scum. Either way, we've found a mafia.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 8:28 am 
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Yeah well that was a good day one then, either we've killed a mafia and confirmed another player, or killed the Med Student and proved Lander as mafia... and Med Student is worthless whilst the Doctor is alive anyway (I didn't exactly get to do much last round as Med Student and we still won).

Come on Host.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 1:48 pm 
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Topsummoner wrote:
That solves that then since I'm the Med Student.

Landerpurex

Reason enough for me. Lander.

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Kikori wrote:
Topsummoner wrote:
Riptide wrote:
I used to get you and J@n mixed up. Except your funnier. And nicer. Happy 21st bro!

Oh man Jan, you just got zinged by Riptide. How much does THAT suck?


Well, statistically speaking, slightly more than a giant suckusaur. A dire one.


PenguinGuy wrote:
Lets see if I remember how to play...

EX REX IS MAFIA SCUM FOURTHVOTER UNVILLAGE BLAH BLAH BLAH SCUM BLAH WINE IN FRONT OF ME BLAH BLAH META GAME BLAH BLAH BLAH SMELLS OF ELDERBERRIES BLAH

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 2:41 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 2:45 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 3:01 pm 
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I just had a fiendish thought. Why did Lander claim med student, the least useful of the special roles? Literally any other claim would have given more info to the mafia. Henry then makes a helpfully unhelpful post about what happened today. Something isn't right here. I'm sure it's not lynching Lander, but between Top, Henry and/or Tahu, I'm uncertain.

Thoughts, anyone? Might as well use the twilight, after all.


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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 3:09 pm 
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Why did Lander claim med student, the least useful of the special roles

if lander is mafia:
if a mafia were to fake something, i think they would say that. and hope someone notices that it is THE most useless roll there(for now). and try to get into the heads of the villagers to sway their votes.

if he was a more powerful role:
he was simply lieing to protect his identity. to get the mafia to look elsewhere tonight for their nightkill.

if landers claim is true:
that will suck. but this is unlikely. because top contradicted him, and claimed that he was the med student. if landers claim was true, top is dead tomorrow.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 3:41 pm 
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Monk Basher wrote:
I just had a fiendish thought. Why did Lander claim med student, the least useful of the special roles? Literally any other claim would have given more info to the mafia. Henry then makes a helpfully unhelpful post about what happened today. Something isn't right here. I'm sure it's not lynching Lander, but between Top, Henry and/or Tahu, I'm uncertain.

Thoughts, anyone? Might as well use the twilight, after all.


My unhelpful post was to basically say that I am back from my night away, and happened to be back whilst Day One was still going so I could comment on what had happened.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 4:49 pm 
Jess
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Not going to bother with a vote since he's already dead, just wanted to say a few things.

Firstly, I don't like Riptide jumping in on the train after it had arrived at the Lynch-Station, he gave an extremely short post with his vote, and I feel it was more a way for him to be able to come back later and say "I was on the Lander train" if Lander does end up being Mafia and the suspicion points Riptides way.

Also as a note outside of this game, I no longer wish to host the next one. I got a full time job recently so during the week I don't have much time until around 6PM. So I don't feel as if I would be able to give the attention to hosting that a Mafia game deserves.

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Day 1
PostPosted: May 24th, 2012, 6:55 pm 
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"I'm the Medical Student," Landerpurex affirmed, hoping his helpfulness to the town would halt the danger he was in. Unfortunately, it had the opposite affect. "I find that unlikely," Topsummoner replied, joining five other people and leading Lander to the gallows. As his body dropped through the hole in the floor, the sudden stop made a sharp black knife fall out of his pocket. A knife that several of them were already familiar with.

Landerpurex - Mafia - Lynched Day 1

For the Village, it was a perfect start. But would they stay out in front for long?

Night 1 has begun
(ends ~8:00 AM on Saturday the 26th)

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 Post subject: Re: Birfurcate Mafia: Act II, Night 1
PostPosted: May 26th, 2012, 12:11 am 
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Seven Villagers reconvened in the morning--everyone except Monk Basher. Everyone knew the drill by now, so they waited for Monk for about half an hour or so, but when he didn't show they left for his house. The door was wide open. Monk Basher was dead on the ground next to his bed, slain of apparent knife wounds. How ironic was it that the one who had killed so many in the night in a previous life was the first to perish in the darkness now?

Monk Basher - Normal Villager - Slain Night 1

The sun had already moved into the sky when the remaining seven returned to the town square. Things were getting intense--someone needed to die, but the Village knew that a misstep here would be costly...

Day 2 has begun
(ends ~1:10 AM CST on Tuesday, May 29th)
7 players remain - 4 votes to lynch

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